Notes and Queries, Number 30, May 25, 1850

BRAYBOOKE.

Lord Monson presents his compliments to the Editor of "NOTES AND QUERIES," and has the pleasure of answering a Query contained in this day's Number, p. 440.; and takes the liberty of adding another.

The English nobleman murdered at Pontoise was Charles Smith, Viscount Carrington of Barrefen, Ireland, and Baron Carrington of Wotton Warem, co. Warwick; the date in the pedigrees of the murder is usually given 1666, probably March 1665-6.

The last Lord Carrington died 17 May, 1706: the estates of Wotton came to Lewis Smith, who married Eliz., daughter of William Viscount Monson, and relict of Sir Philip Hungate. His son Francis Smith Carrington died in 1749, and left one daughter and heir. What relation was Lewis Smith to the Smiths Lord Carrington? No pedigree gives the connection.

Dover, May 4. 1850.

["J.M.W." has kindly answered this Query; so also has "W.M.T.," who adds, "Lord Carrington, previously Sir Charles Smith, brother to Sir John Smith, who fell on the King's side at Alresford in 1644, being Commissary-General of the Horse. By the way, Bankes says it was his son John who fell at Alresford, but it is more likely to have been, as Clarendon states, his brother, unless he lost there both a brother and a son."]

Esquires and Gentlemen.—I would ask your correspondent (No. 27. p. 437.), whether he has ascertained the grounds of distinction made in the seventeenth and in the early part of the eighteenth century, between esquires and gentlemen, when both were landed proprietors? We find lists of names of governors of hospitals, trustees, &c., where this distinction is made, and which, apparently, can only be accounted for on this ground, that the estates of the gentleman were smaller in extent than those of the esquire; and, consequently, that the former was so far a person of less consideration. Had the bearing of coat armour, or a connection with knighthood, any thing to do with the matter?

J.H. MARKLAND.

Bath, May.

Early Inscriptions.—The excellent remarks by "T.S.D." on "Arabic Numerals, &c." (No. 18. p. 279.) have put me in mind of two cases which in some degree confirm the necessity for his caution respecting pronouncing definitively on the authenticity of old inscriptions, and especially those on "Balks and Beams" in old manorial dwellings. The house in which I spent the greater portion of my youth was a mansion of the olden time, whose pointed gables told a tale of years; and whose internal walls and principal floors, both below and above stairs, were formed of "raddle and daub." It had formerly belonged to a family of the name of Abbot; but the "last of the race" was an extravagant libertine, and after spending a handsome patrimonial estate, ended his days as a beggar. Abbot House was evidently an ancient structure; but unfortunately, as tradition stated, a stone, bearing the date of its erection, had been carelessly lost during some repairs. However, in my time, on the white wainscot of a long lobby on the second floor, the initials, "T.H. 1478," were distinctly traced in black paint, and many persons considered this as nothing less than a "true copy" of the lost inscription. Subsequent inquiry, however, finally settled the point; for the inscription was traced to the rude hand of one of the workmen formerly employed in repairing the building, who naively excused himself by declaring that he considered it "a pity so old a house should be without a year of our Lord."

The second instance is that of the occurrence of "four nearly straight lines" on one of the compartments of a fine old font in Stydd Church, near Ribchester, which many visitors have mistaken for the date "1178." A closer scrutiny, however, soon dispels the illusion; and a comparison of this with similar inscriptions on the old oak beams of the roof, soon determines it to be nothing more than a rude, or somewhat defaced, attempt to exhibit the sacred monogram "I.H.S."

J.W.

Burnley, April 27. 1850.

American Aborigines called Indians (No. 16. p. 254.).—I believe the reason is that the continent in which they live passed under the name of India, with the whole of the New World discovered at the close of the fifteenth century. It is, of course, unnecessary to dwell upon the fact of Columbus believing he had discovered a new route to India by sailing due west; or upon the acquiescence of the whole world in that idea, the effects of which have not yet passed away; for we not only hear in Seville, even now, of the "India House" meaning house of management of affairs for the "New World," but we even retain ourselves the name of the West Indies, given as unwarrantably to the islands of the Caribbean Sea. It is needless to do more than allude to this, and to other misnomers still prevalent, notwithstanding the fact of the notions or ideas under which the names were originally given having long since been exploded; such as the "four quarters of the globe," the "four elements," &c. If your correspondent searches for the solution of his difficulty on different grounds from those I have mentioned, it would not satisfy him to be more diffuse; and if the whole reason be that which I conceive, quite enough has been said upon the subject.

G.W.

89. Hamilton Terrace, St. John's Wood.

"Northman" is informed, that on the discovery of America by Columbus, when he landed at Guanahani (now called Cat Island), he thought, in conformity with his theory of the spherical shape of the earth, that he had landed on one of the islands lying at the eastern extremity of India; and with this belief he gave the inhabitants the name of Indians. The following quotations will perhaps be interesting:—

"America persæpe dicitur, sed improprie, Indiæ Occidentales, les Indes Occidentales, Gallis, West Inde, Belgis: Non tantum ab Hispanis, qui illam denominationem primi usurparunt, sed etiam a Belgis, Anglis, et aliquando a Francis, quod eodem fere tempore detecta sit ad occidentem, quo ad Orientem India reperta est."—Hofmanni Lexicon Univ. 1677, sub titulo "America."

"At eadem terra nonnullis India Occidentalis, nuncupatur, quia eodem tempore, quo India Orientalis in Asia, hæc etiam delecta fuit; tum quod utriusque incolis similis ac pene eadern ivendi ratio: nudi quippe utrique agunt."—P. Clurerii Introduct. in Univ. Geographiam, Cap. xi (iv.) 1711.

"The most improper name of all, and yet not much less used than that of America, is the West Indies: West, in regard of the western situation of it from these parts of Europe; and Indies, either as mistook for some part of India at the first discovery, or else because the seamen use to call all countries, if remote and rich, by the name of India."—Heylyn's Cosmography, 1677, Book iv., sub initio.

It is almost needless to mention, that India received its name from the river Indus; and that Indus and [Greek: Indos] are the Roman and Greek forms of Sindo, the name it was known by among the natives.

HENRY KERSLEY.

Corpus Christi Hall, Maidstone.

[We have received many other replies to this Query, referring "NORTHMAN" to Robertson's History of America, and Humboldt's Aspects, &c., vol. ii. p. 319.]

Vox Populi Vox Dei (No. 20. p. 321.).—Your correspondent "QUÆSITOR" asks for the origin of the saying Vox populi Vox Dei. Warwick, in his Spare Minutes (1637), says—

"That the voice of the common people is the voice of God, is the common voice of the people; yet it is as full of falsehood as commonnesse. The cry before Pilate's judgement-seat, 'Let him be crucified,' was vox populi, 'the cry of all the people.' How far was it the voice of God?"

M.

[Mr. G. Cornewall Lewis, in his valuable Essay on the Influence of Authority in Matters of Opinion, p. 172., has some very interesting remarks upon this proverb, which, "in its original sense, appears to be an echo of some of the sentences in the classical writers, which attribute a divine or prophetic character to common fame or rumour." See pp. 172, 173., and the accompanying Notes.]

Dutch Language (No. 24. p. 383.).—"E.V." will find Holtrop's Dictionary in 2 vols. one of the best. Werninck's Pocket Dictionary is very good: also Tauchnitz's Dutch and French (pocket): also Picard's English and Dutch. Jansen's is not bad. Swier's Grammar is a good one; but I do not know whether there is any late edition. See Williams and Norgate, or Quaritch.

AREDJID KOOEZ.

[Messrs. Williams and Norgate have also obligingly answered this Query, by the following list:—

PYL (R. van der), A practical Grammar of the Dutch Language, 8vo. Rotterd. 1826, 8s.

AHN (F.) Neue holländische Sprachlehre nebst Lesestucke, 12mo. Cref. 1841, 2s.

AHN (F) holländische Umgangsprache, 12mo. 1846, 1s. 6d.

PICARD (H.) A new Pocket Dictionary of the English and Dutch Languages, remodelled and corrected from the best Authorities. Zalt-bommel, 1848, 10s. 6d.

DICTIONNAIRE Hollandais et Français. 16mo. Leipzig, 4s.

HOLLANDISCH u. deutsches Taschen-wörterbuch. 16mo. 4s.]

"Salting."—Salt is said by all writers upon magic to be particularly disagreeable to evil spirits; and it is owing to this noxious substance being dissolved in holy water, that it has such power in scaring them away. Query, did not salt acquire this high character, and its use in all sacrifices, from its powers of resisting corruption?

Salt is used emblematically in many of our foreign universities. There is a book published at Strasburg as late as 1666, containing twenty plates, illustrating the several strange ceremonies of the "Depositio." The last represents the giving of the salt, which a person is on a plate in his left hand; and, with his right hand, about to put a pinch of it upon the tongue of each Becanus or Freshman. A glass, probably holding wine, is standing near him. Underneath is the following couplet:—

"Sal Sophiæ gustate, bibatis vinaque læta,Augeat immensus vos in utrisque Deus!"

A copy of this rare book was sold in the Rev. John Brand's collection. I have never seen it, and know it only from a MS. note in one of Brand's Common Place Books now in my possession.

EDWARD F. RIMBAULT.

Vincent Gookin (No. 24. p. 385.).—Your querist "J." is referred to Berry's Kentish Pedigrees, where, at pp. 60. 195. 202. 207. and 113., he will find notices and a pedigree of the family Gookin; and therein it is shown that Vincent Gookin was the fourth son of John Gookin of Replecourt, co. Kent, by Katherine, dau. of William Dene of Kingston.

In the early part of the 7th century, Sir Vincent Gookin, Knt. (why was he knighted?) was living at Highfield House, in the parish of Bitton, Gloucestershire. It appears by the register, that in 1635, Mary Gookin, Gentleman, and Samuel, son of Sir Vincent Gookin, Knt., were buried at Bitton.

In 1637, John Gookin of Highfield, age 11 years, was buried in the Mayor's Chapel, Bristol.

1637, Frances, dau. of Sir Vincent Gookin, Knt., and the Lady Judith, was baptized at Bitton.

1637, Feb. 13. "Sir Vincent Gookin, Knt., was buryed" at Bitton.

1642, May 2. "Judith, the Lady Gookin, was buryed" at Bitton.

There are no monuments remaining.

Highfield, with the manor of Upton Cheyney, was a considerable estate in 1627, where it was passed by fine from John and Mary Barker to Vincent Gookin, Esq.

In 1646, Vincent Gookin, Esq. (no doubt the knight's son), and Mary his wife, and Robert Gookin their son, Gent., passed the same estates by fine to Dr. Samuel Bave, after which it is supposed the Gookins left the parish. In Sims' Index are references to pedigrees under Gokin, Kent. Any further notices of Sir Vincent or his son would be acceptable to

H.T. ELLACOMBE.

Bitton, May 20, 1850.

Sneck up (No. 29, p. 467.)—All Shakspearean students will be deeply indebted to you for giving insertion to articles on obsolete words and phrases, so many of which are to found in the pages of the great poet. The article by R.R. is very interesting, but I apprehend that the passage from Taylor, first quoted by Weber, is sufficient to show that the phrase sneck up was equivalent to be hanged! See Halliwell, p. 766, on the phrase, that writer not connecting it with sneck, to latch. Compare, also, Wily Beguiled,—"An if mistress would be ruled by him, Sophos might go snick up." And the Two Angry Women of Abingdon, 1599,—"If they be not, let them go snick up," i.e. let them go and be hanged! These passages will not be consistently explained on R.R.'s principle.

R.

Hanap (No. 29. p. 477.).—I have a few notes by me relative to the drinking vessel, which may, perchance, be acceptable to some of your readers. It was similar to the standing cup and grace cup, as these vessels were subsequently called, being raised from the table by a foot and stem, for the convenience of passing it round the table for the company to pledge each other out of; it was thus distinguished from the cup, which was smaller, and only used by one person. The hanap frequently occurs in wills and inventories of the thirteenth, fourteenth, and fifteenth centuries.

In the will of Lady Calre, 1355,—

"Je devise a ma joefne fille Isabel Bardolf en cide de lui marier un hanap plat door."

And in that of the Earl of March, 1389,—

"Item. nous devisons a notre treschier friere Mons'r. Henri, un hanaper de tortelez ove un ostelle en le founce."

A very elegant specimen is described in the will of the Duchess of Gloucester, 1390,—

"Un hanappe de Beril gravez de long taille, et assis en un peé d'or, ove un large bordur paramont, et un covercle tout d'or, ove un saphir sur le pomel du dit covercle."

In an inventory 19th Henry VI. we find—

"Une haute coupe d'argent enorrez appellez l'anap de les pinacles pois de troie vii lb pris la lb xl. Summa xiii li."

And temp. Edward II 1324,—

"Un hanap a pee de la veille fazon quillere et cymelle el founz du pois xxix, du pris xl."

In the same document several others are described having feet. I could give many other quotations, but will conclude with only one more, as in the last occurs the word kyrymyry, of which I should like to know the derivation, if any of your readers can assist me:—

"Item, un hanap d ore covere del ovrage d un kyrymyry et iij scochons des armes d Engleterre et de Franuce en le sumet."

I have met with notices of cups "covered of kerimery work," and "chacez et pounsonez en lez founcez faitz de kermery;" and the following, from the Vision of Piers Ploughman, would seem to indicate a sort of veil or net-work:—

"He was as pale as a pelet,In the palsy he semedAnd clothed in a kaurymaury,I kouthe it nought diseryve."W.C.

Jun.

MISCELLANIES

Bishop Burnet as an Historian.—Dr. Joseph Warton told my father that "Old Lord Barthurst," Pope's friend, had cautioned him against relying implicitly on all Burnet's statements; observing that the good bishop was so given to gossiping and anecdote hunting, that the wags about court used often to tell him idle tales, for the mischievous pleasure of seeing him make note on them. Lord Bathurst did not, I believe, charge Burnet with deliberate misrepresentation, but considered some of his presumed facts questionable, for the reason stated.

ELIJAH WARING.

Dance Thumbkin.—In the Book of Nursery Rhymes, published by the Percy Society, there is a small error of importance, involving no less that the learned would call "a non sequitur," and which, if my correct-and-almost-unequalled nurse, Betty Richins, was alive, she would have noticed much sooner that the nurseling who now addresses you. (She died about the year 1796.) In the valuable and still popular nursery classical song, "Dance Thumbkin, dance," it is not only an error to say "Thumbkin he can dance alone" (let any one reader of the "NOTES AND QUERIES," male or female, only try), but it is not the correct text. Betty Richins has "borne me on her knee a hundred times" and sung it thus:—

Thumbkin cannot dance alone.So1 dance ye merry men, every one."

I scarcely need add, that if this be true of Thumbkin, it is truer of Foreman, Longman, Middleman, and Littleman.

R.S.S.

King's Coffee-house, Covent Garden.—As an addition to "Mr. RIMBAULT's" Notes on Cunningham's Handbook, the following extract from Harwood's Alumni Etonenses, p. 293., in the recount of the boys elected for Eton to King's College may be interesting:—

"A.D. 1713, 12."

"Thomas King born at West Ashton in Wiltshire; went away scholar, in apprehension that his fellowship would be denied him, and afterwards kept that coffee-house in Covent Garden which was called by his own name."

J.H.L.

Spur Money (No. 23. p. 374, and No 28. p. 462.).—In a curious tract, published in 1598, under the title of The Children of the Chapel stript and whipt, we have the following passage:—

"Wee think it very necessarye that every quorister sholde bringe with him to churche a Testament in Englishe, and turne to everie chapter as it is daily read, or som other good and godly prayer-booke, rather than spend their tyme in talk and hunting after spur-money, whereon they set their whole mindes, and do often abuse dyvers if they doe not bestowe somewhat on them."

In 1622, the dean of the Chapel Royal issued an order by which it was decreed—

"That if anie Knight, or other persone entituled to weare spurs, enter the chappell in that guise, he shall pay to y'e quiristers the accustomed fine; but if he command y'e youngest quirister to repeate his Gamut, and he faile in y'e so doing, the said Knight, or other, shall not pay y'e fine."

This curious extract I copied from the ancient cheque-book of the Chapel Royal.

Within my recollection, His Grace the Duke of Wellington (who, by the way, is an excellent musician) entered the Royal Chapel "booted and spurred," and was, of course, called upon for the fine. But His Grace calling upon the youngest chorister to repeat his GAMUT, and the "little urchin" failing, the impost was not demanded.

EDWARD F. RIMBAULT.

MISCELLANEOUS

NOTES ON BOOKS, CATALOGUES, SALES, ETC

Mr. W.S.W. Vaux, of the department of Antiquities, British Museum, has just published a very interesting little volume under the title of Nineveh and Persepolis: an Historical Sketch of Ancient Assyria and Persia, with an Account of the recent Researches in those Countries. The work is illustrated with numerous woodcuts; and the two points which Mr. Vaux has proposed to elucidate,—viz., 1. The history of Assyria and Persia, and, as connected with it, that of the Medes, the Jews, and the Chaldees, so far as it can be ascertained from the Bible, and the works of classical authors: and 2. The results of those inquiries which have been carried on for nearly three centuries by European travellers,—he has successfully accomplished, in a way to make his book a most useful introduction to the study of the larger works which have been written upon this important subject; and a valuable substitute to those who have neither the means to purchase them, nor time to devote to their perusal.

The Rev. Dr. Maitland has just published a second edition of his Eruvin, or Miscellaneous Essays on Subjects connected with the Nature, History, and Destiny of Man. The Essays are ten in number, and treat: I. On the Nature and Objects of Revelation. II. On the Impediments to the Right Understanding of Scripture. III. Man before the Fall. IV. Satan. V. The Consequences of the Fall. VI. The Fallen Angels. VII. The Millenium. VIII. The Kingdom of Messiah. IX. The Regeneration. X. The Modern Doctrine of Miracles. We mention the subjects of these papers because, although they are of a nature not to be discussed in our columns, we are sure many of our readers will be glad to know the points on which they treat.

We have received the following Catalogues:—Bibliotheca Selecta, Curiosa et Rarissima. Part First of a general Catalougue of Miscellaneous English and Foreign Books now on sale by Thomas G. Stevenson, 87. Princes Street, Edinburgh—(a Catalogue well deserving attention of our Antiquarian friends); John Miller's (43. Chandos Street) Catalogue of Books Old and New; W.S. Lincoln's (Cheltenham House, Westminster Road) Catalogue No. 56., May, 1850, of English, Foreign, Classical and Miscellaneous Literature.

Messrs. Sotheby and Co., of Wellington Street, will commence on Monday next an eight days' sale of the valuable library of the late Rev. Peter Hall, consisting of rare and early English Theology, Ecclesiastical History and Antiquities, Foreign and English Controversial Works, Classics, Biblical Criticism, &c.

BOOKS AND ODD VOLUMES WANTED TO PURCHASE

(In continuation of Lists in former Nos.)

GORGH (R.), CATALOGUE OF ALL WORKS PRINTED RELATING TO WALES.

A Pamphlet ON THE LEAD AND SILVER MINES OF GOWER, published about a century since.

SECOND TRAVELS OF AN IRISH GENTLEMAN IN SEARCH OF A RELIGION, BY BLANCO WHITE.

Letters, stating particulars and lowest price, carriage free, to be sent to Mr. Bell, Publisher of "NOTES AND QUERIES," 186. Fleet Street.

NOTICE TO CORRESPONDENTS

COMPLETION OF VOLUME THE FIRST. The present Number completes the First Volume of NOTES AND QUERIES, to which a Title-page and copious Index will be printed as soon as possible: when copies of it may be had in cloth boards. In the meantime, may we beg such of our Subscribers as have not complete sets, to secure such Numbers as they may be in want of without delay.

Errata.—No. 28. p. 452., for "Bayle" read "Bale," and for "Carood" read "Câwood." No. 29. p. 467., for "dick the string" read "click," and for "bung" read "bang."

HYMNS AND POEMS FOR THE SICK.

SECOND EDITION.

In small 8vo., price 7s. 6d.

HYMNS and POEMS for the SICK and SUFFERING. In connection with the Service for the Visitation of the Sick. Edited by the Rev. T. V. FOSBERY, M.A., Perpetual Curate of Sunningdale.

This volume contains 233 separate pieces, of which about 90 are by writers who lived prior to the eighteenth century; the rest are modern, and some of these original. Amongst the names of the writers (between 70 and 80 in number) occur those of Sir J. Beaumont, Sir T. Browne, F. Davison, Elizabeth of Bohemia, P. Fletcher, G. Herbert, Dean Hickes, Bp. Ken. Norris, Quarles Sandys, Bp. J. Taylor, Henry Vaughan, and Sir. H. Wotton; and of modern writers, Miss E.B. Barrett, the Bishop of Oxford, S.T. Coleridge, Sir R. Grant, Miss E. Taylor, W. Wordsworth, Rev. Messrs. Chandler, Keble, Lyte, Monsell, Moultrie, and Trench.

RIVINGTON'S, St. Paul's Church Yard, and Waterloo Place.

DR. MAITLAND'S ERUVIN—SECOND EDITION

In small 8vo., price 5s. 6d.

ERUVIN; or Miscellaneous Essays on Subjects connected with the Nature, History, and Destiny of Man. By the Rev. S.R. MAITLAND, D.D. F.R.S. & F.S.A.

RIVINGTON'S, St. Paul's Church Yard, and Waterloo Place;

Of whom may be had, by the same Author,

1. ESSAYS on the REFORMATION in ENGLAND. 15s.

2. ESSAYS on the DARK AGES. Second Edition. 12s.

LAWYERS, SOLICITORS, PERIODICAL PUBLISHERS, and MUSIC SELLERS, &c. will find the newly-invented PAMPHLET or LETTER BINDER the most useful article yet offered to the Public for the purpose of facilitating the binding of extracting of any Letter or Pamphlet, without the possibility of deranging the consecutive order of such documents. They are equally useful as Music Binders or Portfolios, as it forms a perfect book, whether inclosing one sheet or five hundred. As a Portfolio, it is invaluable, as it precludes the possibility of the drawings being broken or in any way injured.

To be had of DE LA RUE and Co., Stationers, Bunhill Row, or of any other respectable Stationer.

Now Publishing