Notes and Queries, Number 06, December 8, 1849

With every wish for the success of your undertaking,

Yours, &c.

D.S.

[The late Sir H. Nicolas compiled an account of the publications of the Record Commission, which was published in his Notitia Historica, and also in an 8vo. vol, and is easily obtainable. There is also a series of articles in the Gentleman's Magazine for 1834, which contains a good deal of information upon the subject, with a classified list of the publications. The principal unpublished records are in the Tower and the Rolls' Chapel; any record may be inspected or copied at those places, or in any other Record Office, upon payment of a fee of one shilling.]

Katherine Pegge

Sir,—Katherine Pegge, one of the mistresses of Charles II., was the daughter of Thomas Pegge, of Yeldersley, near Ashborne in Derbyshire, Esq., where the family had been settled for several generations, and where Mr. William Pegge, the last of the elder branch, died without issue in 1768. Another branch of this family was of Osmaston, in the same neighbourhood, and of this was Dr. Samuel Pegge, the learned antiquary. They bore for arms:—Argent, a chevron between three piles, sable. Crest:—A demi-sun issuing from a wreath or, the rays alternately argent and sable.

It was during his exile that the King first met with the fair Katherine, and in 1657 had a son by her, whom he called Charles Fitz-Charles,—not Fitz-roy as Granger says. Fitz-Charles had a grant of the royal arms with a baton sinistre, vairé; and in 1675 his Majesty created him Earl of Plymouth, Viscount Totness, and Baron Dartmouth. He was bred to the sea, and having been educated abroad,—most probably in Spain,—was known by the name of Don Carlos. In 1678 the Earl married the Lady Bridget Osborne, third daughter of Thomas Earl of Danby, and died of a flux at the siege of Tangier in 1680, without issue.

Katherine Pegge, the Earl's mother, after her liaison with the King, married Sir Edward Greene, Bart., of Samford in Essex, and died without issue by him in –. From this marriage the King is sometimes said to have had a mistress named Greene.

There was long preserved in the family a half-length portrait of the Earl, in a robe de chamber, laced cravat, and flowing hair (with a ship in the back-ground of the picture), by Sir Peter Lely; and also two of his mother, Lady Greene: one a half length, with her infant son standing by her side, the other a three-quarters,—both by Sir Peter Lely, or by one of his pupils.

Both mother and son are said to have been eminently beautiful.

G.M.

East Winch, Nov. 30.

N., who refers our Querist for particulars of this lady to the "Memoirs of the Rev. Dr. Samuel Pegge and his Family," in Nichols' Literary Anecdotes of the Eighteenth Century, vol. vi. pp. 224, 225, adds—"As the lady had no issue by Sir Edward Greene, it perhaps does not matter what his family was.

"I see he was created a baronet 26th July, 1660, and died s. p. Dec. 1676; and that Courthope, in his Extinct Baronetage, calls his lady 'dau. of – Pegg,' not being aware of her importance as the mother of the Earl of Plymouth. This may be worth remarking."

The Rev. T. Leman

Sir,—Your correspondent A.T. will find the information he requires respecting the Reverend Thomas Leman, of Bath, in the Gentleman's Magazine for Oct. 1826, p. 373.; for Aug. 1828, p. 183.; and for Feb. 1829. He may also consult Britton's Memoirs of the Life, Writings, and Character of Henry Hatcher.

G.M.

A Memoir of the Rev. Thomas Leman will be found in Nichols's Illustrations of Literature, vol. vi. p. 435, et seq., comprising an enumeration of his writings in various county histories and other works of that character, and followed by eighteen letters addressed to Mr. Nicholls, J.N. Brewer, Esq., and the Rev. Dr. Samuel Parr.

N.Burnet Prize at Aberdeen

Sir,—I sent a query to the Athenæum, who, by a note, referred it to you.

My object is to ascertain who gained the last Theological Premium (forty years since, or nearly) at Aberdeen. You no doubt know the subject: it is the best Treatise on "the Evidence that there is a Being all powerful, wise, and good, by whom every thing exists; and particularly to obviate difficulties regarding the wisdom and goodness of the Deity; and this, in the first place from considerations independent of Written Revelation, and, in the second place, from the revelation of the Lord Jesus; and, from the whole, to point out the inferences most necessary for and useful to mankind."

I wish to know who gained the first prize, and who the second premium.

H. ANDREW

Manchester, Nov. 27, 1849.

[We are happy to be able to answer our correspondent's query at once. The first Burnet prize, on the last occasion, was gained by the Reverend William Lawrence Brown, D.D., and Principal, if we recollect rightly, of Mareschal College, Aberdeen. His prize work, entitled Essay on the Existence of a Supreme Being possessed of Infinite Power, Wisdom, and Goodness, was published at Aberdeen in 2 vols. 8vo. 1816. The second prize man was the present amiable and distinguished Archbishop of Canterbury. His work, entitled A Treatise on the Records of Creation, was published in London, in 2 vols. 8vo. 1816.]

Incumbents of Church Livings

Sir,—In answer to the Query of your correspondent L., I beg to inform him that he may find the name, if not the birth-place, of incumbents and patrons of Church Livings in the county of Norfolk, long prior to 1680, in the Institution Books at Norwich, consisting of numerous well preserved folio volumes. Blomefield and Parkin, the historians of the county, have made ample use of these inestimable books.

G.M.History of Landed and Commercial Policy of England—History of Edward II

In reply to the two queries of your correspondent ANGLO-CAMBRIAN:—

1. The Remarks upon the History of the Landed and Commercial Policy of England was written by the Rev. Joseph Hudson, Prebendary of Carlisle, 1782, "a judicious and elegant writer, who could not be prevailed on to give his name with it to the public."—See Nichols's Literary Anecdotes of the Eighteenth Century, vol. viii. p. 160, note. Mr. N. characterises it as "a valuable work, richly deserving to be better known."

2. There are two histories of King Edward II., one in small folio, of which the title is accurately given by your correspondent, and another in 8vo., the title of which is given at the head of the reprint in the Harleian Miscellany, vol. i. p. 69. Both these editions bear the date of 1680. I had always supposed that the edition in 8vo. was a mere reprint of the folio; but on now comparing the text of the folio with that of the 8vo. as given in the Harl. Miscellany, I find the most essential differences; so much so, as hardly to be recognised as the same. Mr. Park, the last editor of the Harl. Miscellany (who could only find the folio), appears to have been puzzled by these differences, and explains them by the supposition that the diction has been much modified by Mr. Oldys (the original editor of the Miscellany), a supposition which is entirely erroneous. The "Publisher's Advertisement to the Reader," and the "Author's Preface to the Reader," signed "E.F.," and dated "Feb. 20, 1627," are both left out in the 8vo.; and it will be seen that the anonymous authorship and date of composition in the title-page are suppressed, for which we have substituted "found among the papers of, and (supposed to be) writ by, the Right Honourable Henry Viscount Faulkland."

Antony Wood, without absolutely questioning its authenticity, seems to have regarded it as a mere ephemeral production, as brought out at a time "when the press was open for all such books that could make any thing against the then government, with a preface to the reader patch'd up from very inconsiderable authors, by Sir Ja. II. as is supposed."—Athen. Oxom. vol. ii. p. 565. There is not the slightest evidence to connect the authorship either of the folio or the 8vo. with Henry Viscount Falkland.

Your correspondent A.T. (p. 59.) will find all the information he desires about the Rev. Thomas Leman, and the assistance he rendered to Mr. Hatcher in his edition of Richard of Cirencester, in Mr. Britton's own Autobiography. See pp. 7 and 8.

C.L.L.To eat Humble Pie

Mr. Editor,—Your correspondent, Mr. HAMMACK, having recorded Mr. Pepys's love of "brave venison pasty," whilst asking the derivation of the phrase, "eating humble pie," in reference to a bill of fare of Pepys's age, I venture to submit that the humble pie of that period was indeed the pie named in the list quoted; and not only so, but that it was made out of the "umbles" or entrails of the deer, a dish of the second table, inferior of course to the venison pasty which smoked upon the dais, and therefore not inexpressive of that humiliation which the term "eating humble pie" now painfully describes. The "umbles" of the deer are constantly the perquisites of the gamekeeper.

A.G.

Ecclesfield, Nov. 24, 1849.

MINOR QUERIES

Eva, Daughter of Dermot Mac Murrough

Mr. Editor,—I should be glad if any of your readers, Irish or English, could inform me whether we have any other mention of Eva, daughter of Dermot Mac Murrough, last independent king of Leinster, than that she became, in the spring of the year 1170, the wife of Richard Strongbow, Earl of Pembroke, at Waterford.

Any fortunate possessor of O'Donovan's new translation of The Annals of the Four Masters, would much oblige me by referring to the dates 1135 and 1169, and also to the period included between them, for any casual notice of the birth of this Eva, or mention of other slight incident with which she is connected, which may there exist.

A. HAPLESS HUNTER

Malvern Wells, Nov. 20, 1849.

John de Daundelyon

Sir,—In the north chancel of St. John's Church, Margate, is a fine brass for John Daundelyon, 1445, with a large dog at his feet; referring to which the Rev. John Lewis, in his History of the Isle of Tenet, 1723 (p. 98.), says:

"The two last bells were cast by the same founder, and the tenor the gift of one of the family of Daundelyon, which has been extinct since 1460. Concerning this bell the inhabitants repeat this traditionary rhyme:

"John de Daundelyon, with his great dog,Brought over this bell on a mill-cog."

This legend is still given to visitors of this fine old church. Will some of your antiquarian correspondents throw some light on the obscurity?

C.Genealogy of European Sovereigns

Sir,—Can you or any of your correspondents tell me of one or two of the best works on the "Genealogy of European Sovereigns?" I know of one,—Anderson's Royal Genealogies, London, 1732, folio. But that is not of as late a date as I should wish to see.

Q.X.Z.Duke of Ashgrove

At p. 14. of Doctor Simon Forman's Diary (edited by Mr. Halliwell, 1849), mention is twice made of Forman being engaged as "Scholmaster to the Duke of Ashgrove's Sonnes." Who was the person thus alluded to?

P.C.S.S.Sir William Godbold

Mr. Editor,—In the Gentleman's Magazine for July, 1842, occurs this:—

"In the parish church of Mendham, Suffolk, is a mural monument bearing an inscription, of which the following is a transcript:

"'M.S.V.Cmi Doctissimique D. Gulielmi Godbold Militis ex illustri et perantiquâ Prosapiâ oriundi, Qui post Septennem Peregrinationem animi excolendi gratiâ per Italiam, Græciam, Palæstinam, Arabiam, Persiam, in solo natali in bonarum literarum studiis consenescens morte repentinâ obiit Londini mense Aprilis Ao. D. MDCXIIIC, ætatis LXIX.'

"One would presume that so great a traveller would have obtained some celebrity in his day; but I have never met with any notice of Sir William Godbold. I have ascertained that he was the only son of Thomas Godbold, a gentleman of small estate residing at Metfield, in Suffolk, and was nephew to John Godbold, Esq., Serjeant-at-Law, who was appointed Chief Justice of the Isle of Ely in 1638. He appears to have been knighted previously to 1664, and married Elizabeth daughter and heir of Richard Freston, of Mendham (Norfolk), Esq., and relict of Sir Nicholas Bacon, of Gillingham, Bart., whom he survived, and died without issue in 1687. I should consider myself under an obligation to any of your correspondents who could afford me any further account of this learned knight, or refer me to any biographical or other notice of him."

To the writer of that letter the desideratum still remains unsupplied. Your welcome publication appears to offer a channel for repeating the inquiry.

G.A.C.Ancient motto

Many years since I read that some pope or emperor caused the following, or a motto very similar to it, to be engraven in the centre of his table:—

"Si quis amiecum absentem rodere delectat ad hanc mensam accumbere indignus est."

It being a maxim which all should observe in the daily intercourse of life, and in the propriety of which all must concur, I send this to "NOTES AND QUERIES" (the long wished-for medium), in the hopes that some kind "note-maker" can inform me from whence this motto is taken, and to whom ascribed.

J.E.M.Works of King Alfred

Sir,—If any of your readers can inform me of MSS. of the Works of Kings Alfred the Great, besides those which are found in the larger public collections of MSS., he will confer a favour not only on the Alfred Committee, who propose to publish a complete edition of King Alfred's Works, but also on their Secretary, who is your obedient servant,

J.A. GILES.

Bampton, Oxford, Nov. 23. 1849

"Bive" and "Chote" Lambs

I should be much obliged to any of your readers who would favour me with an explanation of the words "Bive" and "Chote." They were thus applied in an inventory taken Kent.

"27 Hen. VIII. Michaelm.

Bive lambes at xvid. the pece.

Chote lambes at xiid. the pece."

T.W.

Anecdote of the Civil Wars

Horace Walpole alludes to an anecdote of a country gentleman, during the Civil Wars, falling in with one of the armies on the day of some battle (Edgehill or Naseby?) as he was quietly going out with his hounds. Where did Walpole find this anecdote?

C.A Political Maxim—when first used

Who first used the phrase—"When bad men conspire, good men must combine"?

C.Richard of Cirencester

S.A.A. inquires whether the authenticity of Richard of Cirencester, the Monk of Westminster, has ever been satisfactorily proved. The prevailing opinion amongst some of the greatest antiquaries has been that the work was a forgery by Dr. Bertram, of Copenhagen, with a view of testing the antiquarian knowledge of the famous Dr. Stukeley; of this opinion was the learned and acute Dr. Whittaker and Mr. Conybeare. It is also further worthy of mention that some years since, when the late Earl Spencer was in Copenhagen, he searched in vain for the original manuscript, which no one there could tell him had ever existed, and very many doubt if it ever existed at all.

Lord Erskine's Brooms

When and where was it that a man was apprehended for selling brooms without a hawker's licence, and defended himself by showing that they were the agricultural produce of Lord Erskine's property, and that he was Lord E.'s servant?

GRIFFIN.John Bell of the Chancery Bar

When did John Bell cease to practise in the Court of Chancery, and when did he give up practice altogether, and when was the conversation with Lord Eldon on that subject supposed to have take place?

GRIFFINBillingsgate

Mr. Editor—Stow, in his Survey of London, with reference to Billingsgate, states, from Geoffrey of Monmouth, "that it was built by Belin, a king of the Britons, whose ashes were enclosed in a vessel of brass, and set upon a high pinnacle of stone over the same Gate." … "That it was the largest water Gate on the River of Thames." … "That it is at this day a large water Gate," &c. Can you, Mr. Editor, or any of your respected correspondents, refer me to any drawing or description of the said Gate?

WILLIAM WILLIAMS.

Rood Lane, Nov. 24. 1849.

Family of Pointz of Greenham

Mr. Editor,—Can any of your readers inform me if that branch of the ancient family of Pointz, which was seated at Greenham, in the parish of Ashbrittle, in Somersetshire, is extinct, and when the male issue failed? Some of them intermarried with the Chichesters, Pynes, and other old Devonshire families.

The Pointzes remained at Greenham after 1600.

L.B.Marescaucia

Sir,—In the Testa de Nevill appear the following entries:—

P. 237. a "terra Willi de Montellis (read Moncellis) in villa de Cumpton pertinet ad marescauciam domini Regis," &c.

P. 2269. a. "Will's de Munceus tenet Parvam Angram (Little Ongar, in Essex) de Domino Rege de Mareschaucie quæ fuit de Baronia Gilberti de Tani."

P. 235. b. "Waleramus de Munceus tenet Cumpton per serjantiam Marescautiæ."

If any of your readers can throw any light on the signification of the word "Marescautia," occurring in these extracts, and the tenure referred to, they will greatly oblige

D.S.

NOTES ON BOOKS, CATALOGUES, SALES, ETC

The Work of Walter Mapes, "De Nugis Curialium," respecting which we inserted a Query from the Rev. L.B. Larking, in our last number, is editing for the Camden Society by Mr. Wright, and will form one of the next publications issued to the members.

Messrs. Sotheby and Co., of Wellington Street, Strand, will be occupied during the week commencing on Monday, the 17th instant, with the sale of "the third portion of the stock of the late eminent bookseller, Mr. Thomas Rodd, comprising rare and valuable works of the early English poets and dramatists; facetiæ, romances, and novels, and other departments of elegant literature."

Mr. Rodd's knowledge, great in all departments of bibliography, was particularly so in that of our early poetical and dramatical writers; and although the numerous commissions he held for such rarities in it as he secured, necessarily prevented their being left upon his shelves, the present collection exhibits a number of articles calculated to interest our bibliographical friends, as the following specimens of a few Lots will show:—

578 Dedekindus (Fred.) School of Slovenrie, or Cato turned Wrong Side Outward, in Verse, by R.F. Gent. very rare, original binding: sold at Perry's sale for £11 11s. 1605

591 De Soto (Barahona) Primera Parte de la Angelica blue morocco, rare Granada, 1586

No more than the first portion of this poem, which is in continuation of the Orlando of Ariosto, ever appeared. Cervantes notices it with great praise in his Don Quixote.

747 Jests and Jeeres, Pleasant Taunt and Merry Tales (wants all before B 2), VERY RARE.

One of these Jests mentions Shakspeare by name.

1211 MARIE of EGYPT, a sacred Poeme describing the Miraculous Life and Death of the Glorious Convert of, in verse. rare, russia, gilt edges no date (1650)

1212 MARKHAM (Robert), THE DESCRIPTION OF THAT EVER TO BE FAMED KNIGHT SIR JOHN BURGH, fine copy, with port. by Cecill 1628

A POEM OF GREAT RARITY: the Bindley copy, afterwards Mr. Heber's, sold for £15.

1345 SHAKESPEARE (W.), COMEDIES, HISTORIES, AND TRAGEDIES, FIRST EDITION, wanting the title and four leaves at the end, soiled folio, 1623

1451 Polimantcia, or the Means Lawfull and Unlawfull to judge of the Commonwealth, rare 4to. 1595

Notice is made of Shakespeare (R 2), Spenser, Sir D. Lyndsay, Harvey, Nash, &c.

1606 SCOTLAND:—A VERY CURIOUS AND RARE SERIES OF LATIN POEMS (BY ALEXANDER JULIUS) on the Marriage or Deaths of some Scottish Nobles, as the Marchioness of Huntley, Edin. 1607—Countess of Argyle, ib. 1607—Earl Keith, ib. 1609—Earl of Montrose, ib. 1609—Prince Henry, ib. 1612—Fredericke Prince Palatine, ib. 1614—Earl of Lothian; with the author's Sylvarum liber, 1614

Of these rare poetical pieces four are unnoticed by Lowndes; five of them are published anonymously; but their similarity to those with an author's name testifies the source from which the others emanated.

The collection contains a good deal of early Dutch poetry, well deserving attention for the lights which we are sure may be thrown from it upon our own early national literature.

Miller, of 43. Chandos Street, has issued his December Catalogue, comprising, among other articles, "Books on Freemasonry, Poetry, and he Drama, Histories of Ireland and Irish Antiquities," which he states to be "mostly in excellent condition and good binding," and, he might have added, "at reasonable prices."

BOOKS AND ODD VOLUMES

WANTED TO PURCHASE(In continuation of List in No. 5.)

DIBDIN's TYPOGRAPHICAL ANTIQUITIES. Vol. II.

CATALOGUE OF LIBRARY OF JOHN HOLME. Vol. IV. 1830 or 1833. In boards.

PINDAR, BY ABRAHAM MOORE, Part II, Boards. Uncut.

A TRACT, or SERMON, BY WM. STEPHENS, Fellow of Exeter Collegeand Vicar of Bampton, "THE SEVERAL HETERODOX HYPOTHESES CONCERNING BOTH THE PERSONS AND THE ATTRIBUTES OF THE GODHEAD, JUSTLY CHARGEABLE WITH MORE INCONSISTENCIES THAN THOSE IMPUTED TO THE ORTHODOX," &c. Printed about 1719 or later.

[WHEATLEY'S] CHRISTIAN EXCEPTIONS TO THE PLAIN ACCOUNT OF THE LORD'S SUPPER. 1737.

THE APPENDIX TO DR. RICH. WARREN'S AURORA. 1737.

THE APPENDIX TO HOADLEY'S PLAIN ACCOUNT OF THE SACRAMENT.

W.G. BROUGHTON's SECOND REPLY TO AUTHOR OF PALÆOROMAICA.

BRITISH CRITIC for January, February, April, 1823. Uncut.

DR. JOHN EDWARDS' REMARKS AND REFLECTIONS (not his SOME BRIEF CRITICAL REMARKS, 1714) ON DR. CLARKE's SCRIPTURE DOCTRINE.

SPECTATOR, Vol. IV. of the edition in 6 vols. small 8vo., 1826, with Preface by Lynam.

EVANS' OLD BALLADS. Vol. III. 1784.

HOLCROFT's LAVATER. Vol. I. 1789.

EDMONDSON'S HERALDRY. Vol. II. 1780.

FIELDING'S WORKS. Vol. XI. 1808. The 14 vol. Bookseller's edition.

SWIFT'S WORKS. Vol I. of Edition published by Falconar, Dublin. 1763.

ROLLIN'S ANCIENT HISTORY. Vol. I. of 2nd edition in 10 vols. Knapton. 1739.

Letters stating particulars and lowest price, carriage free, to be sent to Mr. BELL, publisher of "NOTES AND QUERIES," 186. Fleet Street.

NOTICES TO CORRESPONDENTS

The matter is so generally understood with regard to the management of periodical works, that it is hardly necessary for the Editor to say that HE CANNOT UNDERTAKE TO RETURN MANUSCRIPTS; but on one point he wishes to offer a few words of explanation to his correspondents in general, and particularly to those who do not enable him to communicate with them except in print. They will see, on a very little reflection, that it is plainly his interest to take all he can get, and make the most, and the best of everything; and therefore he begs them to take for granted that their communications are received, and appreciated, even if our succeeding Numbers bear no proof of it. He is convinced that the want of specific acknowledgment will only be felt by those who have no idea of the labour and difficulty attendant on the hurried management of such a work, and of the impossibility of sometimes giving an explanation, when there really is one which would quite satisfy the writer, for the delay or non-insertion of his communication. Correspondents in such cases have no reason, and if they understoood an editor's position they would feel that they have no right, to consider themselves undervalued; but nothing short of personal experience in editorship would explain to them the perplexities and evil consequences arising from an opposite course.

COMMUNICATIONS RECEIVED.—Naso.—J.I.—W. Robson.—I.F.M.—I.S.—Laicus.—[Omega.]—Marianne.—Q.D.—G.H.B.—J.B.Yates—W.J.B.R—H.C.de St. C.—B.—F.E.—Rev. L.B. Larking (with many thanks).—I.P.L.(Oxford).—A.D.M—W.H.—C.—T.H.T.—L.C.R—I.F.M.

V. who is thanked for his letter, will see by a Note in a former part, that the work of Walter Mapes referred to by the Rev. L.B. Larking, is on the eve of publication by the Camden Society. Mr. Larking's query refers to the transcripts of that and other works made by Twysden.

Articles on "Cold Harbour" and "Parallel Passages in the Poets," in an early number.

MELANION has our best thanks. The Stamp Office affix the stamp at the corner of the paper most convenient for stamping. The last page falling in the centre of the sheet prevents the stamp being affixed to it in that certainly more desireable place.